Posted: Monday, January 28, 2013 9:01 am
We have a gun problem and massacres in schools, and the right’s only solutions more guns in schools. Lets stop and look at the problem from outside of the box and look for better solutions, more guns is not going to solve the problems!
Reynaldo Careaga
Chandler
Posted in Letters to the editor, Opinion on Monday, January 28, 2013 9:01 am. | Tags:
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valleynative posted at 10:04 am on Mon, Jan 28, 2013.
Actually, that wasn't "the right's" only suggestion. That was the NRA's primary suggestion. Dividing all Americans into either Right or Left is counterproductive to ever solving any tough problem.
Others have recommended better screening for mental health problems, better firearms safety education, and encouraging more gun owners to secure their firearms from theft.
For example, the government could make basic firearms safety training tax deductible, and make gun safe purchases tax deductible. These would actually reduce the number of accidents and help to keep firearms out of the hands of criminals.
In contrast, banning certain types of weapons and magazines that are only used in a tiny fraction of all gun crimes cannot, mathematically, have any measurable impact on crime statistics, according to a study commissioned by the Justice Department.
valleynative posted at 10:37 am on Mon, Jan 28, 2013.
And, for clarification, when you say "we have a gun problem", You do realize, don't you, that while there are still too many gun crimes and gun deaths, that the rate of violent crime and rate of gun-related crimes has actually been going DOWN for several years now?
chatmandu002 posted at 11:23 am on Mon, Jan 28, 2013.
It's not a gun problem, it's a mental illness problem. After 40+ years we are seeing the results of the ACLU's fight to get the mentally ill freed and allowed to roam unchecked.
Bluepoet posted at 2:04 pm on Mon, Jan 28, 2013.
I hear the word comprehensive used a lot, when discussing "solutions". Only thing is, that word is just considered another "code" word for gun confiscation. Where do we go, when we can't even get past the paranoia? And, yes, it's 99% a mental health issue. Unfortunately, even there it's more of a blame game than any viable solutions being discussed. Was it the ACLU, defending patient rights, or was it the insurance company HMOs controlling their costs? I think it was a combination of those things, but the result is the same. We have sick people who are not getting treated, and they are acting out...
onerebel posted at 3:01 pm on Mon, Jan 28, 2013.
Does anyone REALLY believe if they do get a assault weapons ban they will call it good and go home? As soon as the next shooting happens they will say we didn't go far enough the first time now we need the pistols, or the shotguns. Some people like Bloomberg never have enough control, first it was smoking, then salt in food, then drink size, and now he wants to control the amount of pain killers a hospital can give to a patient. ARE YOU KIDDING? Do we not see the writing on the wall from these people? They will never be satisfied until they have full control of our lives!
JMJ posted at 12:00 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Chat, I agree it's a mental health issue. I believe it was Reagan or George H. W. Bush who "freed" the mentally ill. No doubt, it was a cost-saving measure, and not an altruistic bid to help the mentally ill. If you know anyone who is mentally ill and what their families go through between the illness of their loved one and how little that can actually legally be done, you know what I mean.
JMJ posted at 12:01 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
I was raised in an environment where the ACLU was disdained, to say the least. Only after leaving that environment did I come to the realization that the ACLU defends the rights of individuals who are generally marginalized. The mentally ill fit that bill. Not all mentally ill people should be thrown into an asylum to live out their days in a drugged oblivion. The "freeing" of the mentally ill was no doubt a cost-saving measure, and not a humane measure to dignify the existence or de-marginalize that population.
JMJ posted at 12:02 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
As with education in our state, the mentally ill are cared for 50th out of 50 states here. When you think about Newtown, the thing that smacks most obvious is the fact that this wealthy, behaviorally-challenged perp was from a home wherein the means to help him was not an issue. The attempt to "make it all go away" and hand this individual assault rifles was crazier than he was, with apologies to the mentally ill masses who do NOT go out and murder innocent children all in the name of pretending that their mental illness doesn't exist and that it can be made all better with an AK-15.
JMJ posted at 12:02 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
When parents try to instill false self-esteem and do not face reality, when a society has no teeth until after there are bodies on display, when assault rifles are available to the nut down the street [ask these people's teachers--they can tell you, right away, who's sketchy--better than most other "professionals"], when people with legitimate problems and diagnoses do not get the help they need--well, we have a recipe for continued disaster.
The reality check is coming too late, unfortunately, for many. But, freedom to live life within the bounds of normalcy cannot necessarily be defined or legislated--or ignored. It is very complicated--as we see. Locking up all mentally ill people or banning guns to law abiding citizens oversimplifies a situation that is not that cut and dried.
Having limits on large capacity magazines seems to be a good place to start. Having better mental health care seems to be another. Most people who are mentally ill are more afraid of the rest of us than "we" are of them. If they're lucky, they are able to get the help they need and lead as normal a life as the rest of "us".
We can't blame all guns or gun owners. We can't blame all mentally ill people.
JMJ posted at 12:03 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Lousy SPAM filter.
valleynative posted at 7:19 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
JMJ, first, I'd like to challenge you to find any eduction statistic in which Arizona is 50 out of 50. We're near the bottom in spending per student, and below average at the 4th grade reading level (nearly half of our 4th graders have no books in English in the home), but our SAT and ACT test scores are consistently above the national average.
Secondly, limiting the capacity of magazines might be a good place to start if magazine capacity was really a factor in shootings. In both of the sensational shootings in the past few years where large capacity magazines were used, those oversized, aftermarket magazines jammed, probably saving lives. Loughner wasn't able to change the clumsy magazines (twice the normal length) and Holmes' drum magazine jammed before he got off many rounds, forcing him to abandon his rifle and switch to shotgun and pistol.
Arizona Willie posted at 8:42 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Well, maybe instead of arming every teacher and janitor in the public school system we should revert to having all students wear a uniform --- made out of Kevlar!!
Yeah, that's the ticket. If Republicans have their way we will be embroiled in wars around the world from now on ( gotta use that military somehow and use up all those bombs and ammo we keep making ) and many of the students will wind up serving in the military because all the regular jobs have been sent to China and India, so get them used to wearing Kevlar armor 24 hours a day.
Might as well start them off in Kindergarten so it becomes second nature to put on their armor before stepping out the door. Might be a drive by shooting break out before they even get to school.
valleynative posted at 10:11 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Arizona Willie, just out of curiosity, are all the world's problems the fault of the Republican Party? And did you forget about Obama attacking Libya?
Arizona Willie posted at 10:40 am on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
valleynative: No, not all of the world's problems are the fault of the Republican Party, just most of the problems we face in America.
It is the Republicans who started two unfunded wars, not Obama. And Obama didn't commit ground troops to Libya and he has refused to get America involved in Syria despite the Republicans calling for us to jump into that mess.
It is the Republicans who believe in BORROW AND SPEND and leave the bills to the grandkids and who refuse to raise taxes to pay the bills they ran up with their unfunded wars and Medicare Prescription benefit. Republicans LOVE to spend but they REFUSE to pay the bills.
DonMey posted at 12:55 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Armed guards at schools aren't meant to prevent shootings at schools. They are meant to prevent massacres at schools. That's a big difference.
VofReason posted at 1:10 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Not sure why a prod further into AzWillie's world, but I will bite. What about all the Demorat congressman and senators who voted to go to war in Afghansitan and Iraq? You remember the way the US use to go to war- by act of congress?
Who exactly will be paying off the debt our current President has been racking up? Or is the only reason he has been spending money at such a clip to make up for all the evil underhanded things that Republicans did before he came to office?
I agree, raise taxes to pay for the money that current politicians (R and D) are spending- find out how quickly people will react to it.
Arizona Willie posted at 1:53 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
VofReason: yes a lot of Dems voted for the wars --- because THEY WERE LIED TO.
They were shown satellite pictures and told their experts knew EXACTLY where the WMD'S were and that these photos were proof --- but they were NOT.
Unfortunately, the trusted the pResident. They didn't believe a President would lie to them.
THEY WERE WRONG.
Arizona Willie posted at 1:59 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
VofReason: I believe you know very well that Obama spent what he did to fight off a Depression that was being triggered by the wild spending of the Bush regime.
In the past, when we got into a war, we had tax surcharges to pay for it.
Even with the surcharges debt mounted but the surcharges kept it from becoming the HUMONGOUS burden Bush's Follies caused.
You can't start two unfunded wars and an unfunded Medicare Prescription Benefit and GIVE TAX CUTS TO THE WEALTHY without destroying the economy which is precisely what had happened under Bush.
He blew the surplus left by Clinton and caused the country's economy to go in the toilet.
Arizona Willie posted at 2:06 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
VofReason: People will scream blood murder if their taxes were raised, no question about that.
Bitter medicine it will be --- but someday, someone will have to pay taxes to pay the debt.
Bush destroyed the economy and Obama doubled the debt. No argument.
But, actually, who is guilty of what is pretty much irrelevant in one sense.
The debt is here --- it HAS to be paid.
valleynative posted at 4:08 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
I wish people had to take some basic economics test before being able to vote.
Bush was an idiot, but he had virtually nothing to do with the *GLOBAL* economic collapse. That was caused by the collapse of a secondary market that Congress had decided years earlier (under Clinton) not to bother to regulate.
onerebel posted at 7:24 pm on Tue, Jan 29, 2013.
Wow, Az Willie, do you REALLY believe what your saying? Trying to continue to blame Bush for Obama's out of control spending STILL? So is the Benghazi cover up Bush's fault too? I'm sure you think it is.
k33j88 posted at 5:28 am on Wed, Jan 30, 2013.
Hey there guys and gals! Because of my move to a new home in the Valley of the Sun, I've been out of touch with all of your wisdom and foresight. Nice to see the vitriol hasn't missed a beat.
k33j88 posted at 5:37 am on Wed, Jan 30, 2013.
It's been proven time immemorial----more guns(possessed by law-abiding citizens) equals less crime. Question is: Where did I put that "gun-free zone" sign and where do I hang it for all the evil, mentally-challenged out there to read?