Budget realities might force Gilbert to alter the level of services and amenities it provides, some of the candidates for May’s runoff Town Council election suggested in a forum hosted Monday by the East Valley Tribune.
Watch videos from the East Valley Tribune's Gilbert Town Council candidate forum.
The six contestants for three open seats — incumbents Linda Abbott, Ben Cooper, Dave Crozier and Les Presmyk and challengers Victor Petersen and Jordan Ray — met with the Tribune’s editorial board Monday at the paper’s new Tempe office. The town’s projected $6 million deficit for the upcoming fiscal year was one of the major concerns.
“We need to have a discussion as a community about what level of service we need and expect, and what’s the cost,” Cooper said. “Then, we need to determine how to pay for it, and develop ways to do it.”
Most were loathe to increase taxes, with Petersen saying, “That’s the easy out. It’s not the direction we should go.”
In their first forum together since advancing to the runoff in March’s primary election, the candidates addressed such topics as the town manager search, controversial Zinke dairy land purchase and protecting Gilbert’s small-town farming and ranching heritage as it has grown into the state’s seventh-largest municipality.
Challenger Eddie Cook received enough votes in the primary to win a seat outright, meaning that at least one of the incumbents will not return after the May 17 election. The new Council will be seated on June 23.
Ray said that, from a planning standpoint, the recent economic slowdown has been a blessing for Gilbert.
“After being one of the fastest-growing communities in the country for so long, we can catch our breath and come up with a good strategy,” Ray said. “A lot of that will involve attracting high-paying jobs.”
Abbott said that the home-building collapse was especially jolting for Gilbert, “so the challenge is the expansion and development of new business,” she added. “This is an area the town has already been successful” in, she said.
Save for brief sparring between Presmyk and Petersen on budget issues, the forum’s tone was civil, even during talk of the Zinke land deal that has been one of the biggest issues in the campaign.
In a deal approved by the Council in January 2009, the town paid $42.7 million for 142.5 acres of land — or $300,000 per acre, about 10 times what surrounding land sold for at the time — from dairy owner Bernard Zinke for future parks and roadways. No appraisal was commissioned during the sale, which was negotiated by then-Town Manager George Pettit.
Abbott, Crozier and Presmyk were on the Council then; all voted yes.
“With 20/20 hindsight, was it a good deal? Absolutely not,” Presmyk said. “I would be the first one to admit that.
“But Gilbert builds large parks for the region. At the time, parcels of land the size that we bought were becoming more and more scarce. If the economy had stayed up, we would not be having this discussion.”
The town has since changed its land-acquisition policy to prevent similar breakdowns. The Arizona Attorney General’s Office is investigating the Zinke transaction.
“It was the right land, right location, right time, wrong price,” Ray said. “I hope and think that nothing illegal was done by the Council. I think it was a complete oversight by the Council. … I hope we learned our lesson from it, and it was a huge amount of money to pay to learn that lesson.”
Added Petersen: “The buck stops with the Council.”
Abbott said that the Council was unaware that Pettit was not following procedures. Crozier called the Zinke deal a “complex one” involving equipment and rights of way that took two years to finalize, with the market changing during that time.
“I think anyone sitting in their homes today that they bought during the real-estate boom can relate,” Crozier said. “They can look back now and feel that it might not have been a good decision to buy because the house is worth less than what they paid. That phenomenon was at work here.”
In other matters:
• The list of town manager finalists will be released on May 18, the day after the election. A decision could be made before the new Council is seated, but the challengers are having input during the process.
• When candidates were asked what services the town could better provide, Crozier cited road conditions as a concern. “That is becoming a struggle,” he said. “If you neglect roads now, that costs more down the line. Robbing Peter to pay Paul is not an approach you want to take long term.”
• The candidates stressed the importance of preserving the annual Gilbert Days celebration. The rodeo will be held in Apache Junction in 2011 after Gilbert Rodeo Park’s closure, but the parade and carnival will remain inside the town.
• The $6 million deficit for the upcoming fiscal year — about half of what town officials initially feared — is due in part to better-than-expected recent sales-tax receipts and positions that remain unfilled, particularly 18 vacancies in the police department. Money was not the factor in keeping the police positions open, Presmyk said.
“With the budget, that decision makes us look like heroes,” Presmyk said. “But the fact is that we and the (police) department could not find personnel we felt were qualified enough to wear the Gilbert uniform.”
• Contact writer: (480) 898-6301 or dzeiger@evtrib.com
gilbertwatchdog posted at 11:01 pm on Fri, May 20, 2011.
"you and all your loser friends will get to eat crow on May 17. Sit down and get ready for some pie, open wide" - ivotetoo, May 15th
So gee ivotetoo, what happened? Not only did your bff Linda Abbott lose, so did BOTH of her tax and spend forever council members!
Looks like all those "losers", you know - the voters that wanted local politicians to be actually fiscally accountable to the people, simply decided to show up and let Gilbert's town council know they didn't want more years of tax and spend after all.
Don't worry, though, it looks like Linda and company will continue to spend taxpayer money during their final days in office. Perhaps some of that "free" grant money will make it's way to your little corner of the parallel universe you're living in.
gilbertwatchdog posted at 10:58 pm on Thu, May 12, 2011.
For those that haven't seen the AZ Republic's reporting yet, here you go ....
I think it's a good bet that Ms. Roberta "Bobbi" Smith will never receive the same level of punishment for her illegal actions that any one of Linda Abbott's detractors would if they were caught doing the same thing, as Linda has many contacts within town government that will, in all likelyhood, take great care that Bobbi Smith will receive every possible legal break.
Consider this, here's a woman (Bobbi Smith) that's caught red-handed by Gilbert Police committing the crime (and admits to it) and a former Gilbert Town Councilmen (Don Skousen) rushes to:
a) talk with her (Bobbi Smith), and
b) manage to issue what amounts to a press release that tries to justify her illegal actions at the same time.
I imagine that if a "normal" citizen were being interviewed by Gilbert Police (before being arrested) and a "normal" bystander (in place of a former Gilbert Council member) decided to intervene into the situation that Gilbert PD might have ended up putting two of them in the back of the car, but perhaps I'm reading too much into the situation.
Skousen also told the AZ Republic that "he (Skousen) feels the negative signs are slanderous and that Smith made "a mistake in judgment because she (Bobbi Smith) was infuriated with these idiots."
First, Mr. Skousen is entitled to his opinion. Unfortunately, neither he nor Bobbi Smith understand that basic constitutional right of free speech. Ms. Abbott's detractors, and there are many to be sure, have absolutely every constitutional right to their opinions regarding Ms. Abbott's qualifications (or lack thereof) for any public office.
Mr. Skousen should also be keenly aware that claiming that the detractors (to Ms. Abbott's campaign) are "idiots" is quite possibly both slanderous and libelous as well (since he was aware that his statement would be quoted and printed), and since the Gilbert Police Department on scene had no trouble contacting the owner of the politcal signs in question (meaning that they were legal political signs). Thus the only reason Ms. Bobbi Smith actually had (in illegally removing the signs) was that she didn't like the political message contained on the signs. Fortunately for the rest of Gilbert, Ms. Bobbi Smith is not in charge of Gilbert's Sign Police.
Second, Linda Abbott's defenders rail against those that point out undisputed facts about her town council record, ignoring that Ms. Abbott's record is out there for all to see (if only they wish to look). I have not seen (or heard) anyone that's made fun of Ms. Abbott personally, or watch she looks like, or what clothes she wears, etc., etc. - no, every issue has been about her voting record, which is how it should be during an election.
Ms. Bobbi Smith may think Linda Abbott walks on water (and that's her right to have that opinion), but others also have the same right to believe that she doesn't, and the right to point out what they consider many past costly mistakes within her voting and spending record, plus political statements that simply weren't true (like laying off dozens of Gilbert Fire and Police if Prop 406's tax increase wasn't passed).
That's called democracy folks, and if your candidate can't take it, both she and her husband (if the allegations of him being photographed outside Town Hall also illegally removing campaign signs are true), should get out of the race.
Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/community/gilbert/articles/2011/05/12/20110512gilbert-community-activist-accused-stealing-campaign-signs.html#ixzz1MClawRMn
gilbertwatchdog posted at 2:17 am on Wed, May 11, 2011.
Abbott and Cooper right for Gilbert's future? Well, let's look at that a bit more subjectively.
First, Ms. Abbott. Yes, it's true that she gets things done, but only the things she wants done, not what's truly good for the average "Joe" in Gilbert.
Her list of "things" getting done would include being instrumental in bringing the SEIU union into Gilbert. You know, the same union that boycotts Arizona over SB1070. The same union that our current President is so fond of as well. The same union that she counts on for political support for her campaign (no double standard there, I'm sure).
Her fondness for union's doesn't stop there. She was also a big supporter of starting Gilbert's own unionized Fire Department, pushing a private fire fighting business out of Gilbert, and just by happen-stance, her husband is heavily involved in the unionized Gilbert Fire Department (surprise, surprise).
Ms. Abbott also has an apparently never balanced a checkbook either, since she voted to support spending millions for the Big League Dreams park (while we were entering a recession), and millions more for the Zinke Dairy fiasco (while we were smack dab in the middle of the recession).
In each case, she has claimed over and over again that these reckless financial decisions were great for her vision of Gilbert, never mind that the taxpayers are always stuck writing ever larger checks to help "her" vision become a reality.
It seems curious (again just a lucky break) that Ms. Abbott seems to be spending a considerable amount of her campaign money on web site ads in certain local newspapers, newspapers that seem to have missed why spending $90 million plus (for just these two projects alone) has caused the Gilbert town budget to go into the red.
To be sure, Ms. Abbott was not the only town council member to vote for these two fiscal fiasco's (and that are running for re-election, the others being Crozier and Presmyk) but she certainly has stated over and over that she still thinks these two projects are great for Gilbert.
If Ms. Abbott had any flair for history, when hearing of the complaints from the taxpayers, she might utter "let them eat cake", for her attitude toward the average taxpaying citizen in Gilbert surely must be very similar indeed.
As for Mr. Cooper, it's true that he did not vote for either Big League Dreams or the Zinke Dairy fiasco's (as he was not on the council at that time), but he was hand picked by the current council members (Abbott, Crozier and Presmyk) so one can assume that they viewed his fiscal and political thinking as similar to their own.
Indeed, Mr. Cooper has not gone out of his way to distance himself from these spending disasters, nor has he publically called for the release of ALL Gilbert documents (including any and all executive meetings and minutes) related to the Zinke land deal.
He may be a fine man, but when you're hand picked to join a club with members of questionable fiscal ethics, you need to establish yourself as above reproach to the average taxpayer and citizen, and his campaign has largely been silent on these matters. Perhaps he doesn't understand the need to distance himself from "the good old boys" politically, or perhaps he feels right at home there, but we may never know and his silence could cost him the election.
That leaves Victor Petersen and Jordan Ray as the only two "unknowns" still in the mix. I don't know either man (or his family) personally, but them being outsiders made be their single biggest plus in this upcoming election.
Politically, they may be newcomers, and yes they may make mistakes (if elected) at some point in the future, but can you imagine they would do as poor a job representing the average Gilbert taxpayer as Abbott, Crozier, or Presmyk have during the past several years? I can't.
gilbertwatchdog posted at 2:14 am on Wed, May 11, 2011.
Abbott and Cooper right for Gilbert's future? Well, let's look at that a bit more subjectively.
First, Ms. Abbott. Yes, it's true that she gets things done, but only the things she wants done, not what's truly good for the average "Joe" in Gilbert.
Her list of "things" getting done would include being instrumental in bringing the SEIU union into Gilbert. You know, the same union that boycotts Arizona over SB1070. The same union that our current President is so fond of as well. The same union that she counts on for political support for her campaign (no double standard there, I'm sure).
Her fondness for union's doesn't stop there. She was also a big supporter of starting Gilbert's own unionized Fire Department, pushing a private fire fighting business out of Gilbert, and just by happen-stance, her husband is heavily involved in the unionized Gilbert Fire Department (surprise, surprise).
Ms. Abbott also has an apparently never balanced a checkbook either, since she voted to support spending millions for the Big League Dreams park (while we were entering a recession), and millions more for the Zinke Dairy fiasco (while we were smack dab in the middle of the recession).
In each case, she has claimed over and over again that these reckless financial decisions were great for her vision of Gilbert, never mind that the taxpayers are always stuck writing ever larger checks to help "her" vision become a reality.
It seems curious (again just a lucky break) that Ms. Abbott seems to be spending a considerable amount of her campaign money on web site ads in certain local newspapers, newspapers that seem to have missed why spending $90 million plus (for just these two projects alone) has caused the Gilbert town budget to go into the red.
To be sure, Ms. Abbott was not the only town council member to vote for these two fiscal fiasco's (and that are running for re-election, the others being Crozier and Presmyk) but she certainly has stated over and over that she still thinks these two projects are great for Gilbert.
If Ms. Abbott had any flair for history, when hearing of the complaints from the taxpayers, she might utter "let them eat cake", for her attitude toward the average taxpaying citizen in Gilbert surely must be very similar indeed.
As for Mr. Cooper, it's true that he did not vote for either Big League Dreams or the Zinke Dairy fiasco's (as he was not on the council at that time), but he was hand picked by the current council members (Abbott, Crozier and Presmyk) so one can assume that they viewed his fiscal and political thinking as similar to their own.
Indeed, Mr. Cooper has not gone out of his way to distance himself from these spending disasters, nor has he publically called for the release of ALL Gilbert documents (including any and all executive meetings and minutes) related to the Zinke land deal.
He may be a fine man, but when you're hand picked to join a club with members of questionable fiscal ethics, you need to establish yourself as above reproach to the average taxpayer and citizen, and his campaign has largely been silent on these matters. Perhaps he doesn't understand the need to distance himself from "the good old boys" politically, or perhaps he feels right at home there, but we may never know and his silence could cost him the election.
That leaves Victor Petersen and Jordan Ray as the only two "unknowns" still in the mix. I don't know either man (or his family) personally, but them being outsiders made be their single biggest plus in this upcoming election.
Politically, they may be newcomers, and yes they may make mistakes (if elected) at some point in the future, but can you imagine they would do as poor a job representing the average Gilbert taxpayer as Abbott, Crozier, or Presmyk have during the past several years? I can't.
ivotetoo posted at 4:52 pm on Thu, May 5, 2011.
Oh yeah Erin as well, does it bug you that your name is spelled like a girls????
ivotetoo posted at 4:52 pm on Thu, May 5, 2011.
Anita, Jerry, Eric and crew, has to be driving you crazy that Ray and Petersen are not acknowledging your support, running away from the names that are at work so hard for them, instead kissing up to the Chamber, firemen and the community members they are trying to persuade to support them. You may have brought them to the dance, but they are going to break up with you. Watch out, you are out of step........
DeeDShell posted at 5:44 pm on Tue, May 3, 2011.
Gilbert needs CPR...Cooper, Peterson & Ray. Out with those who voted to pay more monies for land than it's actual value. No matter how these scoundrels try to explain why they voted 'yes' on the land pruchase, it still stinks! [thumbup]
gilbertwatchdog posted at 12:24 am on Mon, May 2, 2011.
I never knew (until tonight) that Gilbert had a sister city in Pakistan named Abbott-a-bad, which is what even folks in Pakistan will call their sister city in Arizona if Linda gets re-elected and once again gets back into tax, tax, tax and spend, spend, spend.[beam]
truthcommonsense posted at 9:32 pm on Sun, May 1, 2011.
I say it is time to replace the incumbents for overspending and trying to tax and spend some more... Not to mention the their "lovely" union support they brought to town.
Mrmuggs posted at 4:32 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.
All members of the Gilbert Town councll that were members during the recent land deal that okayed the purchase price that was $50 million over the true value of the land should resign or face recall.
Not only did they give this person a sweetheart deal by paying this amount they then compounded the misuse of Gilbert tax money by letting him get by with paying less taxes on the money he recieved.
Each and every member should be brought up on any possible charges that the state can do within their power to remove these people from office.
gilbertoldtimer posted at 1:57 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.
I normally don't comment in this paper, but reading your comments "as you said taking care of the south of Gilbert" The idea of buying parkland in the southern part of Gilbert is not the issue most have with this council. Its the back door process hiding if from the community, lying about the police, fire and the budget. From your statement it must be OK in your family to lye, cheat and steel money from each other in your family?
KeepingmyFreedom posted at 11:51 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.
I am ready for new faces on the Town Council. I am very supportive of the candidates that the Gilbert Small Business Alliance has endorsed. I want people who have had to make the hard decisions to keep a business going running my town. I am very frustrated with the waste of taxes and the lack of professional attention to decisions.
We do need to all work together in this town...... lets get behind these new business voices. What they say makes good common sense. Vote May 17th for Petersen and Ray. We already have Cook in...yeah !!
activearizona posted at 1:10 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.
I think voting in all of the TEA PARTY members would be a huge mistake for Gilbert. Our town is great because we all work together. If we elect people who want to exclude themselves from everyone else it will do nothing but divide our town. Keep Gilbert Working Together to fix our problems... We need vision and leadership.
Keep Abbott , Crozier, and Presmyk
activearizona posted at 1:01 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.
I for one appreciate all of the effort that the current council took to make sure that South Gilbert is taken care of as well as North Gilbert. I appreciate the hard decisions that had to be made in order to provide amenities like parks for those of us in South Gilbert. I am not short sided and I appreciate the leadership and vision of people like Linda Abbott. I care about my quality of life, but I care more about what the quality of life will be like for my children and grandchildren. Thank you Linda Abbott